The Quest for A Durable Front Crossover Pipe

mbw said:

I reached out to my buddy about this. Waiting to hear back on the manufacturing front.

I don't have one of these handy, but looking at images and reading a bit.. it seems like the factory part is a two piece plastic cast that is bonded together. That obviously makes for a weak point. I am wondering if it would be possible to use a stock part and make an aluminum die casting of it. We would need to work with a company that specializes in this. I looked a few up, like this one in Iowa (near-ish me) that does stuff like this..

It seems like it could get a little expensive, but I am ok with that. It would require finish work to get the o-ring surfaces correct.

Edit: either way, if we get a good CAD model, we could have a few of us go off and individually fund a few prototypes to figure out what the best one is. I doub't any of us care to make this a profit thing. I'd be happy to do all of it at cost if we can keep more LR4 on the road.


https://www.leclairemfg.com/industries-served/engine-components/

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I think cnc machined is going to provide us with the best copy. Any yes, looking at the part it is clearly an abs molded part that is fused together. Getting a cad model will no doubt provide us with the ability to try to source an affordable and durable pipe.

scott schmerge said:

I think cnc machined is going to provide us with the best copy. Any yes, looking at the part it is clearly an abs molded part that is fused together. Getting a cad model will no doubt provide us with the ability to try to source an affordable and durable pipe.

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I am by no means a machinist, so I don't know how it works, but can you CNC a part like this with a complex cavity? Even with a fancy 5 axis, could you get a tool into that? Unless you CNC the different 'halves' like the plastic version and bond them together, I can't see how that would work.

mbw said:

I am by no means a machinist, so I don't know how it works, but can you CNC a part like this with a complex cavity? Even with a fancy 5 axis, could you get a tool into that? Unless you CNC the different 'halves' like the plastic version and bond them together, I can't see how that would work.

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You’d have to bond them. You are correct. That was my plan.

I asked a very trusted machinist about this when it first came up nearly 18 months ago...


"In order to get all the shapes and the through passage, this would be made in either a lost was process or a lost foam process.
This would require several molds. The pieces would then be glued together and a sprue attached to create the part in either of these materials, coated in ceramic the places in a barrel of sand that would pack all around the part inside and out.
Then molted aluminum, zinc or stainless would be poured into the sprue which would dissolve the wax or foam creating the part.
Very expensive to set up unless there is a market that would support the expense.
Because of the low volume of parts, I would estimate the cost per part to be in the several thousand dollar area.
The reverse engineering, molds and putting the process in place with today's cost would exceed $300-500k."

followed by:

"It could be reversed into a manufacturable manifold for a lot less, but one would need a vehicle or the full 3D model of that area on the vehicle to account for fit and clearance when mounted."

That makes a lot of sense. Thanks.

Could we split apart an OE plastic part and laser scan the parts? Fine tune with cad?

mbw said:

That makes a lot of sense. Thanks.

Could we split apart an OE plastic part and laser scan the parts? Fine tune with cad?

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I suppose that would be possible but it comes back down to getting those two pieces back together again in the form of something far more durable than ABS plastic.

Just spitballin' as I know nothing about manufacturing...

What about taking an existing factory piece and wrapping all but the print connections in carbon fiber or fiberglass?

Seems like that might address the most common failure point of the factory bonding of the two halves.

Would the temp of carbon fiber curing destroy the original part?

In as well.

avslash said:

What about taking an existing factory piece and wrapping all but the print connections in carbon fiber or fiberglass?

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I was thinking along the same lines earlier. Is there space / clearance around the pipe to accommodate something like this? If so, I'd think there has to be a way to make it stronger by doing something like this rather than fabricating a whole new part

TheWidup said:

I was thinking along the same lines earlier. Is there space / clearance around the pipe to accommodate something like this? If so, I'd think there has to be a way to make it stronger by doing something like this rather than fabricating a whole new part

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+1. I don't know if the OE part always fails at the same location, but if so, and if that area can be reinforced... might be easier/cheaper?