P2019A error code

Mozambique

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2010 5.0L, 90k miles.
So.........had a few error codes recently for MAF, throttle position etc.
Replaced one MAF sensor and MAF codes appear to be resolved. Just did 300 mile error free trip. Now P219A fuel air imbalance has come up. Had this previously along with MAF code.
Research indicates:

Causes for this code may include: Engine vacuum leak (large) Defective oxygen sensor/s Burnt, chafed, broken, or disconnected wiring and/or connectors Engine exhaust leaks A faulty mass air flow or manifold air pressure sensor Bad fuel pump or clogged fuel filter

Has anyone fixed this particular code to give me an idea of most likely culprit? FYI have just had intake manifold off to fix coolant leak. Replaced inlet port seals and throttle body seals re. Air leaks.
Any suggestions much appreciated!
 

jlglr4

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If the code is for fuel/air imbalance, I think you had it right the first time: P219A. I don’t see any code for P2019A. Is it P219A or something else?
 

Mozambique

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I wrote it down as P0219A and of course then cleared the code. The OBDI scanner identified it as generic 'manufacture control', whatever that means.
I had a P219A before when I was dealing with the MAF, so assumed the same code as they have similar numbers. Now I am not sure, as P0219 is intake manifold runner position sensor............that's a new one! Inclined to think that it was P219A, as I wrote 'A' down. I guess wait for it to reappear to confirm. If it is P219A, then I was inclined to replace the O2 sensors, as no MAP specific code (could be MAP too I gather). Can get a complete set from China for $CAD 200 off ebay, but am then wondering if they are crap and will give me future codes with the added complication of whether it was not the O2 sensors, but something else, OR one of the cheap O2 sensors is a dud. Kills me that in all likelihood the more expensive, 'more reputable' brand sensors come out of the same factory in China. $CAD336 each for OEM from LR made me smile.

I am wondering if a fancier OBDI tool would give more specific codes, or the ILand bluetooth app offered by Atlantic British - any insight on that? If I could avoid a few hit and miss sensor replacement cycles before I resolve an issue, such a tool could pay for itself.
 

jlglr4

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Might be a good idea to get a better code reader. I see you are in Canada - GAP Diagnositcs (GAP IID tool that many of us on the forum use) hails from just outside Montreal, in case you want to support domestic. It’s pricey, but used to be more full featured than the iLand tool. Haven’t compared them in a long time though, so no longer sure of difference in price/features.

My understanding is that the P219A code is for fuel/air imbalance in one cylinder as opposed to a general rich/lean code for the bank. There are no “per cylinder” sensors, so I think this code is set by a monitor in the ECM. I don’t know exactly how it works, but I assume the o2 sensors (which typically oscillate up and down in a smooth wave) shows some kind of spike or dip in voltage on a regular time interval (maybe per the crank or cam position sensors) that corresponds with a brief rich/lean condition. The ECM likely monitors for some such pattern that is supposed to indicate a rich/lean condition in one cylinder and then triggers the code.

If the code is correct, you’d be looking at factors that would affect one cylinder: fuel injector, spark plug/coil pack (if there is any slight misfire), air leak affecting one cylinder (e.g., intake manifold leak, exhaust manifold leak, air leak around plug, exhaust/intake valves, small head gasket leak). I’m guessing, however, that this ECM monitor must be tricked sometimes because the code also lists causes like o2 sensors going bad, exhaust leak beyond the manifold, MAFs, etc., which should affect the whole bank.

I‘m remembering that little bit of orange residue on your intake manifold mating surface - that would be exactly the type of air leak that could cause this code, but I think that was on the wrong bank - the “A” code is for Bank 1, and I think that orange residue was on Bank 2.

At any rate, I think the things to check are: (a) misfire counts on bank 1 to see if any cylinders are misfiring more than others, (b) fuel trims and fuel rail pressures to make sure they look okay, (c) smoke test for vacuum leaks in the intake manifold, (d) leak down test for valves or other cylinder air leaks.

But, as long as it’s driving okay and no CEL, you might just clear and see if it returns, perhaps with other codes that can point in a more specific direction.
 

Mozambique

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I looked at the GAP IID tool online today. Are you referring to the 'pro' model or the standard model? Pro was I recall over $2k, whereas the standard model at $700 was affordable.
Thanks a ton for you your thoughtful response!
So Bank 1 is passenger side and bank 2 is drivers side - correct? Yes, the orange residue was on drivers side and was on all cylinders. I don't recall if it was on the other bank too?
So it sounds like O2 sensors cannot be totally ruled out.......

Your 'to check list':
(a) misfire counts on bank 1 to see if any cylinders are misfiring more than others - No detectable misfires as far as I can tell. Do I need a stethoscope? :)
(b) fuel trims and fuel rail pressures to make sure they look okay - what is involved in checking this?
(c) smoke test for vacuum leaks in the intake manifold - I suppose burn a rag and let smoke get drawn into air intake and check for signs of smoke around inlet manifold - correct?
I did tighten the intake manifold bolts to 25nm in a criss-cross pattern for even seating.
(d) leak down test for valves or other cylinder air leaks - what does this entail?

At present I may just wait to see if DTC(s) return as you suggest. It took 300 miles for the P219A or whatever to return....... thought I was home free!

'slight cylinder head gasket leak' is a bit of a worry..........is there a way to more definitively check that?
 

jlglr4

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GAP IID standard. I think the pro is for more for service people in the repair business - not VIN locked to one vehicle.

The GAP tool should let you view misfires. I don’t think you’d hear anything identifiable with a stethoscope with all the other engine noises. GAP tool also lets you see fuel trims and fuel rail pressure.

Smoke test is done with engine off. Smoke is sent into throttle body or other point on air intake plenum (close off all other exits) with a little pressure and then you watch for where it comes out. You can buy or rent smoke testers - most require a regulated compressor, or there are DIY homemade solutions used with a bike pump. You can also hold a punk stick around various places to see if the smoke gets sucked in while engine is running, or run some propane alone the air intake and listen for the engine revs to change. But its not nearly as good as a smoke test, especially if you’re trying to test the intake manifold most of which you can’t really get to well with a smoke stick or torch.

The leak down test is done by pressurizing the cylinder and seeing if it holds air. If it leaks much, you can figure out where it’s leaking out by listening for the leak in various places. Again - its a gadget you can buy or rent and hook up to an air compressor.

Head gasket - leak down test should produce bubbles in the coolant. But I think if you had a head gasket problem, you’d be having some other symptoms as well. Noticeable misfire, coolant loss, white smoke from tailpipe, coolant in oil.

You also can get leak down and smoke tests done at a garage as well - probably not too expensive, but go someplace reputable. Still, I might wait a bit and see what happens with that code, especially if you are planning to get a better scanner.
 

Mozambique

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Thank you!
Am pondering GAP IID tool.........how long do I want to keep the car vs. how long till my wife kicks up hell and wants a replacement :)
 

Mozambique

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Reading the GAP IID FAQ sections on their website................. they state: "Keep in mind that a Land Rover without any fault codes doesn’t exist".

:)
 

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