Plugs

[sledmaker]

The dealer in Hoffman estates told me that using any plugs other than double platinum would cause the car to die. Hmmmmm. Are the ignition systems THAT marginal?

 

[Chongo]

Try going to another shop or dealer.

Wow.....................................! I guess I'd go to another dealer. My dealer had simular shortcomings............

What he said is false

Good luck..................... Chongo

 

[wolf]

Bosch Gets the credit, It said so on the box. lol

Well, for starters Land Rover didn’t design the engine, Buick did.
Land Rover bought a engine design and dies from Buick years ago. Buick Engineers, From who I have talked to, retired now, said the Buick engineering was disappointed in the design falling short of their goals, and that the engine was very difficult in passing emission test. Too numerous modifications were necessary to alleviate longevity issues and the emission problems, so selling the design and dies seemed attractive to Buick, since some of the key issues have to do with the original design and how long ago that really was.

External engine design issues:

# 1 Crankcase ventilation. Or positive crankcase ventilation { pcv } system. First of all there are no check valves in this system. Should the engine backfire, it will pressurize the crankcase. So I placed check valves in the system.
2nd The pcv system is all pretty much at the same level as the pressure differential source…. Aka…vaccum, and all land rovers I’ve seen have an oily residue in the hoses, leading to the intake. Oil going down the intake is not a good idea. Oil when compressed quickly can ignite far before the plugs fire to light the mixture in the combustion chambers before their predetermined time. This is somewhat how a diesel engine runs, not gasoline. Oil, yes oil can cause the timing of your ignition system to change and become more advanced. This not only kills horsepower, but causes detonation. This kills valves, seats and pistons & rings, and is one of the Achilles heals of the land rover longevity designs. I heavily modified this system, after seeing all land rover rear tailpipes oily black inside…………… I found a good cure was to drill and thread a hole in the oil pan for a ¼” npt ****** with a male 3/8” hose barb on the other end. A 3/8” hose goes from the oil pan to the bottom of a filtered reservoir, which both valve cover hoses tee into. On the top part of the box above the filter, is the line that goes to the intake plenum.
This helps a lot, and aids in cleaning up tail pipe issues. The filter system does need to be replaced periodically, it gets oil soaked.

Exhaust gas flow: pure and simple, the more bends and the more restrictions, the less flow. In back pressure, pipe size, and volumetric efficiency
aid in cylinder scavenging properties. In modifying this unit, you have to know your physics, or leave it to the aftermarket people who design these systems. Porting in the wrong place will cost you horsepower. I’ll have to admit, after opening the manifolds, and a few modifications here and there, I prefer the stock system, It’s well thought out, and a little porting, and a baffle, and it really flows well without that tinty sound of headers. I not only ported the manifolds, but I flowed both sides with the heads on so they match. The baffle placed between all head exhaust ports and exhaust manifold ports aids in cylinder scavenging properties.

The plenum………….. I tried and tried to get the runners to match, got close but there is room for improvement on design here. I don’t know of a fix here without throwing the original one away and starting over.
On the flow meter, I got a few really close, but a couple are off. I’d like to see each port balanced, but not with this design. There’s some turbulence issues in the plenum, they’re not horrendous, but not balanced. And balancing it is tricky!

Exhaust valves: I’m not running Land rover valves. I’m using stellite seats and sodium filled valves. Exhausts have rotators on them.
Intake seat pressure is 90 lbs same with exhaust . At .450” lift the intake is at around 200 lbs and the exhaust is at around 240 lbs for the extra weight of the rotators. The rocker assembly was modified to contact the valves properly.

Push rods, I’m using fully adjustable pushrods, all seated @ + .040” deep into hydraulic lifter. I replaced all lifters.

Cylinder liners: I replaced them all. When I rebuilt my wife’s engine I replaced the liners……….. About $80.00 per bore to eliminate the old liner and $90.00 per liner plus another $60.00 per liner to trim the bottom to fit and install. It costs around $1,900.00 just to change the liners. I feel it was worth every dime. No problems and we are getting around 16 m.p.g. we fitted the new steel liners and kept the bore to use the old pistons that only had 29,000 miles on them. I know it’s expensive, but it is the ultimate cure for dissimilar materials in this environment.

Surface tension of oil:

When I bought the land rover repair manual, I shook my head and said why ?
Main crankshaft clearances = +/- .0004” - .0009” . These bearings spend their whole life trying to spin in the journals. I’d be afraid to put anything thicker than 5-20 wt oil in it. It’s a little too tight for good sense, and costs horsepower. Surface tension of oil becomes a serious issue when all you have is .0002” clearance on each side. I opened all bearings, mains and rods to .0018” or .0009” on each side……….. It spun sooooooo sweet when I finished.

Head gaskets procedure:

I took a good look
how the head gasket is designed and it comes with a sticky adhesive on the
composite part of the gasket. This will work beautiful if both surfaces are left
perfectly dry, and free of oil, i.e. lacquer thinner. Use NO OIL PERIOD on the head bolts, You’ll regret it if you do. You see the oil you put on the threads, like the book tells us to, will push off the threads as you thread it into the threads of the block and it
gets between the block and head pushing into the gasket areas ruining the effects of
the adhesive on the gasket, Oil and adhesive isn't usually a good combination......

What I did and this works well, I put only 2 layers of Teflon Tape on the threads of the new head bolts and a small amount of grease just under The bolt head. What this does is not let the bolt head gall into the heads and lubes The threads into the block without any oil. I believe this is an area where a lot of people have got themselves into trouble, and they followed the book. This would probably cause gasket failure in a few thousand Miles or so, and would probably be blamed on the mechanic or machinist, when it is A procedure problem. Use the Teflon tape on the bolts, it runs in nicely and life Is good.
Remember, Torque in the sequence the book tells you to follow at 15 ft lbs, then turn 90 degrees more repeating the same sequence, then an additional 90 degrees more repeating the same sequence completes this task.

This is a few of the modifications I did. Oh I almost forgot, I used the new Bosch Iridium plugs. It said on the box, guaranteed better performance and mileage………. So I guess they get the credit. Lol

So far 3900 on the engine......... still the same mileage.
either that or the man at the shell station needs to re-calibrate his pumps.

Chongo

Hi Chongo;

Ok - a couple of questions here: do you have any e-pix of your mods that you could post? I am especially interested in your well-thought through PCV system. also, have you thought of chipping your GEMS? See RPI UK .

Wolf

 

[Chongo]

Wolf: I took a couple of pictures during engine installation only, and the pictures I took don’t really show what I did after looking at them. So I’m modifying the breather box this month, and when I do I’ll take a few pictures for you. With my current work load I’ll have this done in a few weeks.
Yes, I thought of a chip, but I only posted a few of the redesign modifications there was a lot more. I’m not posting all the redesigns, just the ones I’m 100% on, for obvious reasons.

ttl.............Chongo

 

[wolf]

99D2……………………. Yeah me too, used the new bosch iridium’s.
Don’t ask me why I tried them, but I did. With all the modifications I did to the engine and plugs I think I broke the Land rover mileage code. And after filling up the tank tonight with just over 2200 miles on the new engine, my wife and I drove 298 miles on 14 gallons of fuel, and some of that was driving in Camarillo and Westlake shopping on city streets. I did the math and it comes out to 21.2857 miles per gallon, it’s either doing really well for mileage or The gas station I go to needs to re – calibrate their pumps. The computer hasn’t compensated for anything yet, and it doesn’t seem to be hunting anymore as well. After I rebuilt it, the first tank was an honest 16 mpg, it’s just been getting better until we hit the 500 - 600 mile mark and it’s been sticking around 20, and peaks at 21+ mpg Since. The odometer isn’t off either, our odometer agreed with map quest within a mile.
On the side of the box, where the new bosch plugs were in, it said,” guaranteed better mileage and performance.” So I guess according to Bosch they get all the credit…… he he he……. Talk to ya later…… Chongo.

Hi Chomgo;

What was the part number on those Bosch Iridium as I am tryting to get a set up here in the Great White North?

Wolf

 

[Chongo]

Hi Chomgo;

What was the part number on those Bosch Iridium as I am tryting to get a set up here in the Great White North?

Wolf


Well, in response to your question, I’ll have to pull a plug wire when my wife comes home and see which ones they were, I didn’t keep the receipt, but I’ll put it on my post by this weekends end.

They are the Bosch platnum fusion plugs #4501 posted as promised

My wife is the one who picked these plugs out after I matched the heat range I wanted, and there was no other logic applied. Bosch is a good plug, but not my favorite. There is no listing for Bosch Iridium plugs for the land rover and it is due to the heat range of this plug. Due to the modifications to this engine that I’ve done, I can use a much colder plug than the Champions, which results in more advanced timing, higher cylinder pressures with equal or lower thermals acquired in the plug. To be quite honest with you I would not suggest using these plugs in a stock land rover, you’ll foul these out in no time, in a stock engine They are not the correct heat range for your engine.
I am very fond of Autolite plugs myself, and my favorites are Denso and NGK Iridium’s And the “u” groove plugs are a great asset.
Selecting the right plug for your vehicle is never easy, and sometimes more trial and error than anything, and no 2 engines run exactly the same. Picking The correct plug for your engine is probably one of the most overlooked and misunderstood issues in engines today. This page here explains plugs very well:

http://www.landroverworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=11849


Stock Land Rovers like a fairly warm plug to burn off all the oil it digests due to the crank case breather system. All that should ever go down the intake is air and fuel vapor period, not any oil. Oil in the intake system will eventually form deposits in the combustion chamber. These embers left by the oil actually cause pre – ignition, and detonation, and is extremely hard on your engine, and this is why I modified this breather system. This link is how I recommend to modify this system:

http://www.landroverworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=11815

The brand of plug you choose is personal preference and the experience you have acquired with your vehicle, there is no other formula. They all have their place and their pluses and drawbacks, and remember, always try to obtain the coldest heat range of plug that won’t foul in your engine. And sometimes for dirty engines, this is the hottest plug they offer……………

Good luck…………… Chongo

 

[99d2]

I'm looking into the new Strontium-90 plugs. You don't even need a coil or plug wires---they fire on their own.

Only complaints so far seem to be related to people having their hair/teeth fall out and their bones ache. Seems a small price to pay for good gas mileage. Luckily, the Chinese have lots of lead paint available

I've heard good things about Dilithium crystals in the brake fluid too.

Has anyone ever tried to graft a blower or turbo on to a LR engine? I wouldn't think it would be difficult, but I'm afraid to imagine the results.

 

[wolf]

Hi Chongo;

No need to pull those plugs I have been leaning toward Denso Iridiums anyway!

Wolf