Camping Trailer

[danrhiggins]

When I was gorging on research I spent a lot of time on the main Airstream forum (airforumsdotcom). The prevailing opinion seemed to take a dim view of the Andersen in that bunch.

I also look at the Airstream forum from time to time. Their trailers tend to be heavier and there are a lot of Hensley fans there. As for the Andersen, I think it is probably a great option in a lot of situations. But at some point may not have enough to offset marginal balances in the TV vs TT when in challenging situations like 40 MPH crosswinds on a narrow highway with lots of traffic and an inexperienced driver.

 

[danrhiggins]

Here's our LR4 hooked up with my Northtrail 31QBS...we are actually casually considering trading our 31QBS for a different floor plan, since our kids are now both teenagers and could use bigger sleeping bunks (have been looking at several of the double-queen-bunk model offerings while still staying in the ultra-light travel trailer category). Setup is Rhino Hitch + Equalizer Hitch for Weight Distribution and Sway Control.

That is quite a trailer you are towing! Remind me again, Chris, what the total weight and tongue weight are on that trailer? I assume that the "31" designation makes yours much longer than mine. Mine has an overall length of 27' and a floor length of 22.5'

With yours being so much longer, it makes me (again) wonder what I may be doing wrong to feel so much pushing during crosswinds.

 

[danrhiggins]

When I moved up to Load Range E I went with General Grabber AT2's. I suspect the general rules are the same. While the tires are rates at 80 psi I do not keep mine at that level. More in the 42-48psi range based on wear patterns. On a recent rotate and balance at the tire dealer they mentioned how well they are wearing so I likely are close to optimal.

I might lower the psi based on trails or raise based on load.

Hope that helps.

Edit add: Since you are running at 700#'s tongue weight with a large trailer I would bump up the 42-48 to a psi that allows the truck to manage the weight better. Hope your not running OEM tires! Personally I think load range E is minimum for the LR4.

Thanks! That helps. I have BFG 265/60/18s LT E rating on Compomotive wheels. As you indicate they have a max PSI of 80 and are rated at 3,000# at max psi. Of course, I would never get close to that much weight. When not towing I have them at 44-50 which is not far from your 42-48. My concern and therefore my question is what I should use with 700 additional pounds of tongue weight. Right now I have them at 55-65 psi while towing. I have heard horror stories of blowouts due to underinflating. But I am also wondering if I am creating too small a traction patch on the pavement.

 

[danrhiggins]

Camp looks great!

Interesting on the Andersen. I felt like it helped enough with my little trailer and have talked to a number of guys with bigger trailers that I sprung for it. Love to hear your feedback when you go back to your Hensley. I do however think that the LR4 is somewhat of a bouncy rig to tow with due to the nature of the air suspension vs say a stout diesel truck etc.

This. This. Am I confusing the "feel" of towing with the LR4 and its air suspension with trailer sway and loss of control? To be honest, I sometimes feel like the LR4 is a little "loose" on me. It seems I have felt this more since putting on the KO2s. Or maybe my rear suspension is getting "tired". (They replaced the front during my 50K checkup in May as they seemed "soft" to the tech and did it under warranty.)

 

[stew77]

That is quite a trailer you are towing! Remind me again, Chris, what the total weight and tongue weight are on that trailer? I assume that the "31" designation makes yours much longer than mine. Mine has an overall length of 27' and a floor length of 22.5'

With yours being so much longer, it makes me (again) wonder what I may be doing wrong to feel so much pushing during crosswinds.

Thanks Dan...yes, the trailer is long, but it is a true ultralight, and in all my towing with the Equalizer Hitch, I've never experienced any push or sway when towing in heavy crosswinds.

Specs for the Heartland Northtrail 31QBS): Dry weight 5280 lbs, Loaded weight with all of our camping gear is probably around 6200-6500 lbs (but I have not verified on weight scales), Tongue weight is 675 lbs (dry), and it's a 31' Trailer model (via the 31QBS designation), with a Total Length of 33'10". [I'm sorry, I don't know the actual "floor length", so I'm not sure if the floor length correctly corresponds to the 31' model reference]

 

[churious]

This. This. Am I confusing the "feel" of towing with the LR4 and its air suspension with trailer sway and loss of control? To be honest, I sometimes feel like the LR4 is a little "loose" on me. It seems I have felt this more since putting on the KO2s. Or maybe my rear suspension is getting "tired". (They replaced the front during my 50K checkup in May as they seemed "soft" to the tech and did it under warranty.)

I agree. I think its the LR4 suspension design. Trailers seem to push our rigs around a bit imop. I am going to talk to a friend for a test... by borrowing his GL550 and pulling my trailer to feel the difference with my Anderson for a reference comparison. Although Ive never tried another system on the LR4. I could also potentially try his trailer with his equalizer hitch on my LR4 too to see if its any different.

 

[danrhiggins]

Thanks Dan...yes, the trailer is long, but it is a true ultralight, and in all my towing with the Equalizer Hitch, I've never experienced any push or sway when towing in heavy crosswinds.

Specs for the Heartland Northtrail 31QBS): Dry weight 5280 lbs, Loaded weight with all of our camping gear is probably around 6200-6500 lbs (but I have not verified on weight scales), Tongue weight is 675 lbs (dry), and it's a 31' Trailer model (via the 31QBS designation), with a Total Length of 33'10". [I'm sorry, I don't know the actual "floor length", so I'm not sure if the floor length correctly corresponds to the 31' model reference]

Thanks. Floor length is not really that important. Just trying to get an idea of the length/size of the "box" that will be blown around in the wind.

Another question - and I sent you an email on this - what tires do you run and what do you have the PSI set at when towing. I'm trying to use BFG KO2s and because they are LT tires with a max PSI of 80 I'm not clear on where to set the PSI either standard when towing.

 

[danrhiggins]

BTW, here is a nice summary of what is happening when using an Andersen hitch system by an Andersen owner/user on the forum for our trailer brand.

"Two sets of forces will impact the Andersen's Anti-Sway capability.

The hitch pin rides in a tapered sleeve lined with a friction material (like a brake liner). The pin resists rotation caused by the friction of the liner as the trailer rotates side to side relative to the TV (the triangle plate forces this rotation as the trailer pivots).

The amount of friction to the rotation is increased due to the weight of the trailer (tongue weight) which presses the pin down into the liner. But the friction is also increased by the pull on the pin from the chain tension at the triangle plate, combined with the drag of the trailer on the ball which will pull the pin into the back of the tapered sleeve. These forces on the pin combine to increase the friction against rotation of the pin within the sleeve.

The chains themselves primarily serve the weight distribution function by applying the torque to the pin (when view from the side), then to the receiver, to 'rotate' more weight onto the front of the TV compared to the back.

I'm not sure which of the two forces (down vs pull back) is the more dominant in creating the friction of the pin rotation, but I'd guess it's the tongue weight. Increasing chain tension will increase friction, but it also has an impact on what happens when the trailer bounces the TV (or vice versa).

As for what you feel in the TV. Imagine a giant wrench has been applied to a bolt that has been welded to the top of your hitch receiver. Trailer sway is like yanking that wrench from one side to the other. The response of your TV to that torque depends on its suspension and wheelbase. A short wheelbase will feel it more that a long wheelbase."

 

[mpinco]

Thanks! That helps. I have BFG 265/60/18s LT E rating on Compomotive wheels. As you indicate they have a max PSI of 80 and are rated at 3,000# at max psi. Of course, I would never get close to that much weight. When not towing I have them at 44-50 which is not far from your 42-48. My concern and therefore my question is what I should use with 700 additional pounds of tongue weight. Right now I have them at 55-65 psi while towing. I have heard horror stories of blowouts due to underinflating. But I am also wondering if I am creating too small a traction patch on the pavement.

You could be over-inflating for the setup. Try backing off from 60psi to 50psi. You still have stiffer sidewalls and load range E.

Buy a infrared temp gun to measure tire temp, and for that matter everything else. Measure the LR4 tire temps and trailer tire temps. You will get a feel for optimal psi vs temp. Underinflation can raise temp, overinflation can result in less stability as you are running on the center of the tire.

 

[mpinco]

Some further thoughts. In this case the tow vehicle is not your standard solid axle suspension where springs rates are modified to achieve load ratings. These are simple and on the dumb end of the scale.

Land Rover on the other hand is air suspension, EAS, cross-linked, optimized for on and off road and active stability control are on the intelligent end of the scale. All these experiments to add WD and anti-sway are in many ways fighting the LR technology. Not only do they result in suboptimal rides, they may result in less safety.

Lots of discussion out there but in general the confusion always reigns. Early on I also struggled with the same topic. In the end I'm running Rhino hitch and standard towbar/ball. My trailer pulls fine and have yet to encounter issues in all kinds of weather.

FYI:

..... A bulletin from Land Rover Australia states do not use load levelling devices on Discovery 3 fitted with air suspension.