Snow driving tip

[klabat]

Just remember that siping doesn't really cause any edges to "bite" into anything (road or ice) because they are harder than the rubber. The siping works when the tire deforms as it rolls over the surface. This causes a lower pressure in the void created by the siping. This small vacuum is what helps the tire hold onto the surface.

Just my 2 cents!

 

[richpike]

Just remember that siping doesn't really cause any edges to "bite" into anything (road or ice) because they are harder than the rubber. The siping works when the tire deforms as it rolls over the surface. This causes a lower pressure in the void created by the siping. This small vacuum is what helps the tire hold onto the surface.

Just my 2 cents!

I think you may be thinking of something else - siping is just cuts in the tire tread. The rubber is the exact same, and although, in theory, your explanation seems plausible, I would venture that the extra edges created by slicing in to the tire have far more value than any miniscule vacuum created by the sipe itself.

-Rich

 

[roverman]

Yeah, no way on the vacuum. Sounds fun and all but the amount of vacuum that could possibly be made in the cubic centimeter (probably much much less) of air in the sipes touching the ground wouldn't have much effect on a 6000 lb vehicle rolling down an icy road.

Although the sipes don't literally 'bite' into anything, the sipes do help the tire to deform around any imperfections on an icy surface and grab hold of that imperfection. Obviously softer tire compounds can deform and grab better than harder compounds and therefore they make true snow tires out of softer rubber.

Speaking of true snow tires: I am getting my new Nokians installed tomorrow. So you are most certainly welcome, everyone. I have thus ensured a very mild and dry winter for the midwest.

 

[dry_fly]

did anyone actually try the WD-40 thing?

 

[GrahamWelland]

I didn't try the WD-40 (seems like you'd need a lot of it to me!) but I do have siped Nitto's this time around and I have to admit that they did SEEM to feel better in the snow/slush/rain than before. Of course, it could also be because I have new tires vs 50k miles on them

Generally the siping has a number of effects - not so much the vacuum as stated earlier but the voids provide a better ice/water drain as the tread opens up slightly on contact - this helps remove water from the contact patch more efficiently. The extra edges make them more grippy too. In theory it'll also provide a cooler tire temperature in normal conditions and potentially assist in the longivity of the tire - seems like a nice to have feature if it works out to be true but I'm still pretty happy with 50k! vs the stock Badyears. Possible downside is greater susceptibility to chunking.

I'm in the Pacific NW so wet weather performance is key on road. Ditto with mud off road generally.

For winter driving the only thing that let me down in the freezing rain/snow was the lack of a heated front windshield. Ice accumulation on the wipers reducing visibility was kind of a bummer at times - should have got the cold weather package!

 

[allodial]

its a fact.

http://www.discounttire.com/dtcs/tireSiping.dos

 

[CoMclovin]

Siping does provide a slight improvement in snow etc, but you may also find that on dry or sometimes wet rainy pavement your break times * may* increase slightly. I personally don't see the improvement as enough to potentially void my tire warranty, but I know people who swear by it.. Just my two cents

 

[codemonkey]

http://www.discounttire.com/dtcs/tireSiping.dos

Posting a link from a company that sells siping as an addon doesn't quite make it fact.

In general I think if you find you need to make changes to a tire to make it perform differently for your needs, you quite simply chose the wrong tire. Spacing, depth, and width of sipes will need to vary for all kinds of conditions, and I really doubt that DT has done all that work. There are a huge number of factors that go into tread block design, and DT's one-sipe-fits-all approach just doesn't cut it.

This particular line from the DT page just cracked me up:

To sipe (in mass production) after the molding process would be too expensive and time consuming for the manufacturer.

ANYTHING that can be done in a cost-effective way by a guy at the local DT with a custom machine can be done for 1/100th the cost at the point of manufacture.

 

[GrahamWelland]

So rather than sitting on the sidelines lobbing a spoiler & blasting the poster of the link to DT and sipers.com, why not do something constructive rather than just post criticism. Post some fact based cogent arguements why it's a bad idea, proven to be a bad idea, suspected of being a bad idea, or just simply your OWN experience of whether or not it works or not for you.

I did a fair amount of research on the web, including a number of mud, snow and off road racing oriented locations and forums and the general consensus was that it was still effective. Now it does depend on the tires - it's certainly not necessary for those already pre-siped or winter tires but where you've got very 'blocky' tread there seemed to be improvements overall in wet traction and braking. Siping the side blocks of the tires isn't recommended for off-road/AT tires but certainly doing the center of the tires, in the worst case did no harm, and in the best cases improved performance significantly. My own personal experience so far is that, with Nitto Terra's at least, I'm getting better wet weather and snow/ice performance so far. I put over 50k on my last set and they didn't feel this good on road in these conditions. I don't have ANYTHING good to say about the Goodyears so I'll refrain from any further abuse there ...

At the end of the day the tire distributor stands behind the siped tires. I couldn't find a single quote anywhere about people having problems with either tire failure or warranty claims. None. Maybe you can dig some up ...

 

[CoMclovin]

I will vouch for the GY SAs they are among the best tires I've used on the D3!! The truck feels like it's on rails in all situations I've been in so far, including nasty snow storms with icy roads.