Why is the "most capable 4x4" so fragile ?

[Rover Runner]

It's a given "The LR-3 is a piece of junk - but it's my piece of junk!" I drove military grade rovers for years and the big joke was "When you roll it - get out immediately and get it back on it's wheels - otherwise the oil will rain on the spark plugs and you'll never get it running..." So when I bought my 2006 I was expecting just normal maintenance. Wrong..Somewhere in between different manufacturers, everyone had to do something to make it worse. When Ford had it, the heads were the same - but slightly different. There is no list of what Ford parts fit the Rover.

I have over 250

,000 miles on it now, almost all of them off-road responding to emergencies. Stupid faults like the windshield drain were fixed by drilling holes in the floor board to let it drain. Wires corroding in the passenger wirewell was fixed by spraying everything with "Break Free" anti corrosion fluid every 6 months. There is no backup system in case your main battery goes dead and you can't open the rear tail gate was fixed by cutting a hole in the rear panel so you could reach the boden wire connecting to the latch. Yup, it's a pain in the ass, but it's the most fun vehicle I've ever had. Along with our emergency check list items, the last one is: IF CAUGHT IN A WILDFIRE and the engine is dead - GRAB THE EMERGENCY RADIO and the CAMERAS and leave the vehicle with the doors open.

End of problem. LOL

 

[gsxr]

I read similar complaints in the Mercedes world. "Why does [item X] not last longer? Why can't it last the lifetime of the vehicle?"

It's the same with certain items on the LR4, like the control arm bushings. Those are wear items. When they wear out, replace them. Could JLR have engineered a part with equivalent functionality (low NVH, etc) that lasted far longer? Probably. But they didn't. Call it a design flaw, call it cost savings or cheap, regardless we're still stuck with OE bushings that don't last forever.

In both cases, I like the vehicles enough to pay the piper, and replace the offending item. It isn't like there are many equivalent vehicles to the LR4 that offer ALL the same capabilities. If there were, I might be driving a different truck. We plan to keep the LR4 as long as possible.

 

[DMROVER]

Not sure what to do with your post...

Do what you like with it. I asked a general question as a new member to this community regarding durability. That is after all one of the reasons these forums exist. There have been some informative responses and of course - a lot of defensive comments. Typical forum behavior.

 

[DMROVER]

Real 4 wheel drives have always been more maintenance. What gave you the idea it was otherwise?

How do you define "real" 4 wheel drive ?

 

[gsxr]

How do you define "real" 4 wheel drive ?

Put another way, how do YOU define it; or what expectations did you have that were not met with the LR4?

Or, what truck would you buy instead, if you sold the LR4?

Just curious.

 

[dlonesty]

I have a 2011 with the larger engine. I think 2014-2016 were not good years for this truck.
I have 165k on mine and have done the lower control arms, the timing chain and all of the scheduled maintenance. Stay clear of potholes is the best thing for the control arms.I had them done at 70k.
I would NEVER compare this truck to any American ideation of a similar vehicle. There are none.

 

[Houm_WA]

Do what you like with it. I asked a general question as a new member to this community regarding durability. That is after all one of the reasons these forums exist. There have been some informative responses and of course - a lot of defensive comments. Typical forum behavior.

1. I was talking to the guy who had quoted my post. @tacos&beer .
2. Of course people are going to be defensive when you phrase your post as you did. We are all owners and many of us are enthusiasts, so words like "fragile" are going to raise an eyebrow.

Anyhow, I don't consider the bushings that tend to wear early to be a "reliability" item. That would be like saying that since the heavy LR3/4 goes through brakes faster than a Toyota Corolla, it's unreliable. I addressed the bushings and why they are pliant in an earlier post. Yeah...that makes them wear out faster. Most people get 50,000 out of them. YMMV.

The LR3/4 is one of the best vehicles ever made, in my opinion. I don't know as much about the LR4, I don't have one. The LR3 is comfortable, well appointed, handsome, and will go anywhere, anytime. Its capabilities are not hype. Look at the measurables (i.e. ground clearance, angles, crawl ratio, wheel travel). I've had mine on 2 wheels many times, and it's seen its share of abuse and never left me stranded. I even took it to the Yukon Territory a few years back where we encountered every weather/road condition you can think of. Fragile? Not even.

I have 128,000 miles on my '05, which I've had since new. I have 198,000 miles on my '06; about 16,000 of those miles are mine. The LR3 has its common weak points...not too many, but a few. If owners address them, and then are regular about maintenance, it is fully possible (and there are many reports of this) that they go to 300,000 miles. Unreliable? No. High maintenance? Yeah; I'll concede that one.

 

[gsxr]

Unreliable? No. High maintenance? Yeah; I'll concede that one.

Agreed 100%: ^^^

These are 2 different things. Some things that are high maintenance are well worth it.

 

[Davidinseattle]

I have a 2011 with the larger engine. I think 2014-2016 were not good years for this truck.
I have 165k on mine and have done the lower control arms, the timing chain and all of the scheduled maintenance. Stay clear of potholes is the best thing for the control arms.I had them done at 70k.
I would NEVER compare this truck to any American ideation of a similar vehicle. There are none.

you had them done at 70k miles. They likely needed replaced much sooner. I didn't even know ours were bad and didn't even believe they were bad up until the repair. NOTE: the repair was under service contract so I paid $0 for it but I still questioned whether it needed it. They assured me it did.

When I got the vehicle back, it was clear that they were correct. It rode so much better. I think my wife (primary driver) and I (occasional driver) just go use to what felt like a bit of instability when cornering or lane changing. When I picked the rig up, that was all gone. We did not have any clunking or other noises to indicate a problem. The dealer picked it up on a routine maintenance visit.

That said, agree with comments that this is the price of fame. Yes, you can drive a ford explorer or chevy tahoe and not have these issues, but you'll be driving a ford explorer or chevy tahoe. Equation is pretty simple.

 

[DMROVER]

Put another way, how do YOU define it; or what expectations did you have that were not met with the LR4?

Or, what truck would you buy instead, if you sold the LR4?

Just curious.

That's a great question. And just to clarify - the LR4 , has met my expectations. I knew it would be an amazing vehicle and I knew it would be prone to some issues, which is what I expected. My original post here what just a general durability question as I am new to Land Rover which had the unintended consequences of offending some people.

Now, if I sold it - what would I buy. I honestly don't know. The pickings are slim out there as so many SUV's have gone the way of the crossover. On top of the its off road capability - I like the interior space of the LR4 as i prefer to transport my mountain bike & camping gear inside the vehicle. A 4Runner was on my list prior but the engine is weak & the interior is garbage (IMO). There are some interesting vehicles slated to come out this year such as the Defender, new Bronco. Regardless, I have every intention of keeping the LR4 for years to come.