LR5 Release Updates?

[AxelR]

I also love the Sport, old and new. Actually almost got one beginning of this year but my wife prefers the boxier LR4 so we got another LR4.
As far as the FJ Cruiser it is difficult to not like it. Until I sat inside and tried to set a comfortable seating position... bar ergonomics but really cool vehicle.
Interesting fact about the LR4, after 3 years it retains 75% of its value!!! Even better the FJ Cruiser after 3 years retains... 98% of its value!!!!!!!

 

[danrhiggins]

Finally had a chance to read through the sales brochure and all of the specs and dimensions. Still a couple of concerns about turning radius and as for towing it will be interesting to see what guidance they provide on weight distribution and anti-sway hitches. (I don't think the Europeans tend to have a lot of people who pull big travel trailers that act like a sail in the wind. Most of their "demos" tend to be loads that, though heavy, are rather dense/compact/etc.) Anyway, beyond those things I am pleasantly impressed with many of the specs and intrigued by some of the new tech and features. Yes, I miss the lower tailgate. And I miss the ability to have the middle row at a high level than merely flat (handy when you are using the 3rd row as a "virtual office".) And the overall "feel" of the interior doesn't seem to be all that "adventure" focused. But, again, all this has been said before. Yet if all of the new features and tech eventually prove to be reliable, durable (last 300K miles) and if we find we can do at least modest tweaks like slightly larger tires and rock sliders and a decent roof rack then this could be an impressive vehicle for many of us. The pricing falls just a bit under what I paid for my 2016 Land Cruiser. The Land Cruiser doesn't have nearly the features (though its V8 still has a stronger torque/HP combination - at the cost of gas mileage). But it continues to have a strong resale market because it is common for the Land Cruisers to last over 300K miles. Where I was becoming concerned about how many miles I was putting on my LR4 (55K in 2 years) so I was enjoying it less, I don't worry about that on the Land Cruiser. As my 25K/year (no commuting) rate I could comfortably drive the LC (with some maintenance and replacing worn parts) for 12 years!

Bottom line - I like much of the new tech (I am a bit of a geek after all) but I have questions about pulling a large travel trailer and long term reliability and durability. Those questions will be addressed over time. In a few years we'll see. When LR launched the Discovery, there were some hiccups which hurt their reputation. (Also reliability issues with other vehicles so, fair or not, it hurt their reputation and resale value.) But I had 0 issues with my 2014 LR4 and it seemed that reliability generally got better. I'll give LR a pass on the first 2 years of the new Discovery. It is inevitable that things will happen once customers start doing what customers do with these vehicles. So, for me, that mean 2020 to being looking at these again. By then I would expect updated tech, possibly improved engines. And possibly improvements (or fixes) to other areas. I'll presume that most, if not all, of you who jump on this over the next couple of years will be leasing. ;-)

 

[ryanjl]

I had a original Sport prior to the LR4. Inside room (first two rows, anyway) was pretty much the same as the LR3, save for maybe an inch or two of overhead clearance due to the lower roof design. Same steas, same leg room, same everything. Cargo room was... OK for a couple or a small family, nothing like the cavernous trunk of the LR4 of course, and of course no third row of seats (even the new Sport has got what could best described as an "emergency" third row.) The Sport can feel claustrophobic because the whole center console is up high and you feel like you are sitting in a sporty car rather than a truck. I loved the feeling personally, but it definitely needs to be experienced. It is also a lot more fun to drive aggressively, especially when equipped with Dynamic Response. I never regretted switching to the LR4 when my family grew, but I absolutely loved my Sport. It gets a bad rap because it is viewed as a model people buy because they can't afford the real thing, but I disagree. Its driving dynamics were (and are I assume, although I haven't driven one since the new generation Sport came out in 2014) unique in Land Rover's family. The new ones with the V8 (not to mention the SVR) are speed demons. It is a lot of fun to drive and even the original model still looks pretty awesome. Off road, it can do everything an LR3/4 can, as a matter of fact the shorter wheelbase is sometimes an asset. As a former owner, I felt compelled to come to its defense.

I'm 6'5" and my head hits the interior of the original RRS; I haven't sat in the newer model, but I imagine it's much of the same. My dog is a 155 lb. Euro Great Dane.

I'll admit that my issues aren't shared by most.

 

[Surfrider77]

Finally had a chance to read through the sales brochure and all of the specs and dimensions. Still a couple of concerns about turning radius and as for towing it will be interesting to see what guidance they provide on weight distribution and anti-sway hitches. (I don't think the Europeans tend to have a lot of people who pull big travel trailers that act like a sail in the wind. Most of their "demos" tend to be loads that, though heavy, are rather dense/compact/etc.) Anyway, beyond those things I am pleasantly impressed with many of the specs and intrigued by some of the new tech and features. Yes, I miss the lower tailgate. And I miss the ability to have the middle row at a high level than merely flat (handy when you are using the 3rd row as a "virtual office".) And the overall "feel" of the interior doesn't seem to be all that "adventure" focused. But, again, all this has been said before. Yet if all of the new features and tech eventually prove to be reliable, durable (last 300K miles) and if we find we can do at least modest tweaks like slightly larger tires and rock sliders and a decent roof rack then this could be an impressive vehicle for many of us. The pricing falls just a bit under what I paid for my 2016 Land Cruiser. The Land Cruiser doesn't have nearly the features (though its V8 still has a stronger torque/HP combination - at the cost of gas mileage). But it continues to have a strong resale market because it is common for the Land Cruisers to last over 300K miles. Where I was becoming concerned about how many miles I was putting on my LR4 (55K in 2 years) so I was enjoying it less, I don't worry about that on the Land Cruiser. As my 25K/year (no commuting) rate I could comfortably drive the LC (with some maintenance and replacing worn parts) for 12 years!

Bottom line - I like much of the new tech (I am a bit of a geek after all) but I have questions about pulling a large travel trailer and long term reliability and durability. Those questions will be addressed over time. In a few years we'll see. When LR launched the Discovery, there were some hiccups which hurt their reputation. (Also reliability issues with other vehicles so, fair or not, it hurt their reputation and resale value.) But I had 0 issues with my 2014 LR4 and it seemed that reliability generally got better. I'll give LR a pass on the first 2 years of the new Discovery. It is inevitable that things will happen once customers start doing what customers do with these vehicles. So, for me, that mean 2020 to being looking at these again. By then I would expect updated tech, possibly improved engines. And possibly improvements (or fixes) to other areas. I'll presume that most, if not all, of you who jump on this over the next couple of years will be leasing. ;-)

You compare it to your LC, but herein lies the issue with me. Before, you could plunk down around $60k for a nicely equipped LR4 that was capable of pretty much anything you threw at it with only a tire / possibly even a wheel change. The Land Cruiser, as nice as it is, has always been a $80-90k vehicle. Go to the LR USA website and spec out one of these new Discoveries and you need to spend north of $75k+ to get features that were standard on the base SE model LR4. ie: Air Suspension, hi/low range gear box, etc.

Sure, some of the newer tech looks nice. I just don't see how the LR4 has jumped nearly TWENTY GRAND since 2013. Especially now that the engine is worse vs the 5.0 V8 and all of the other compromises to the new model (turn radius / departure angles / etc)

Even if there were no compromises in performance and specs, it has effectively priced itself out for me. The aggressive price increases in such little time is completely unreasonable to me.

 

[jaamrode]

I can do build with the new discovery HSE with 7 seats and a hi/low transfer case and air suspension for an MSRP of $59100. So what other options do do you think you need to spec out to make it comparable to the LR4 SE?

 

[danrhiggins]

You make an excellent point. LC is not the best comparison. Not a Land Rover. Clearly Toyota is about reliability/durability and not exactly known for industry leading innovation, style and features/tech. (I find their Entune system and Voice Command to be very disappointing. KDSS works reasonably will. Interior seating configurability is at least 15 years old.) People are willing to pay $80K+ for an LC or $90K+ for an LX570 (I paid under $79K for my LC) in large part because of the reputation of reliability. Also, the LC only comes one way in the US. The only option is color - and there are not very many choices of color! Oh, and whether or not you want the remote start. And Toyota doesn't seem too concerned about selling large numbers of them. The LC may be their "flagship" but it certainly is not their bread and butter.

Again, to your point, it makes more sense to compare LR to LR (LR4 to a comparably equipped Discovery - as much as that is possible). I personally don't see the new changes worthy of the price increase. I am intrigued with some of the new features - intrigued but not "must have". I do like the increased ground clearance and break over angles and wading depth. But the new tech features need to be proven out. If the clever new features start breaking down and require lots of trips to the dealership it is going to reinforce the existing (market) perception of poor LR quality.

As for the engine, I wonder if they will ever bring an engine that compares to the MY13 LR4 V8 in HP and torque. I doubt it. I suspect the most powerful engines will be reserved for the Range Rovers.

BTW, for the most part I am very happy with my LC. Gave up some things. Gained some things. Not an LR4. Some overlap in purpose. But different.

 

[cperez]

I appreciate the defense of the original RR Sport which was offered from the perspective of a Land Rover- and driving enthusiast. Unfortunately, in my DC suburban area, the people who drive LRs are neither. There's a reason I don't bother to post "parking rules" photos. At any given moment in Potomac Village, you might see LRs stacked up 3 and 4 abreast in the parking lot...not including the ones double-parked in front of Starbucks. Potomac people can't be bothered to actually park and walk for their hourly macchiato. And waving to a fellow LR driver on the road? You'd get a blank stare in return. Not that I'm bitter.

 

[Jerbo]

I appreciate the defense of the original RR Sport which was offered from the perspective of a Land Rover- and driving enthusiast. Unfortunately, in my DC suburban area, the people who drive LRs are neither. There's a reason I don't bother to post "parking rules" photos. At any given moment in Potomac Village, you might see LRs stacked up 3 and 4 abreast in the parking lot...not including the ones double-parked in front of Starbucks. Potomac people can't be bothered to actually park and walk for their hourly macchiato. And waving to a fellow LR driver on the road? You'd get a blank stare in return. Not that I'm bitter.

I can confirm this behavior. One the rare occasion when I do get a wave back I freak out.

Now for the RRsport for me who I think may have kicked off the discussion RRS drives amazingly, I just don't like the seating position with respect to the dash.

 

[cperez]

I can confirm this behavior. One the rare occasion when I do get a wave back I freak out.

I do make the effort to tap the horn and salute any older Disco or P38 (or older) I see on the road, whether it's stock or built up. And I think it's illegal to fail to wave at any Defender or Series.

 

[jaguardoc504]

What a departure though... I like progress, but it has quickly made the LR4 a classic design.
To me it looks like the LR5 is poured over the wheels, and given a droopy, basset hound look to it.