Worried 2000 DII

[stb616]

I was browsing looking for others who may have had issues like mine and found a few things but I'll recap and see what thoughts you guys might have.

2000 DII w/ 101K miles

My wife uses this as her daily driver so I don't drive it as much as I used to. I filled up with gas the other day and then drove it again after a bit. It used about a half of tank of gas with only about 110 miles on the trip. I thought it had been getting worse milage lately but that was a shock to me.

Anyway, it was admittedly overdue for plugs and wires so I did those and I've noticed a bit of a tick thats been getting a little worse. So I did a compression test when I did the the plugs. 7 came back at about 155psi but my #1 came back at only 125psi. This also seems to be the side the tick is on. So with the poor milage, compression test results, and the noise I'm a little worried about what this might be.

So far I've done:

Plugs & Wires
SeaFoam in the intake (the neighbors love it when I do that).
After SeaFoam I changed the oil and filter replaced on quart of oil with AFT and have about 50 miles since that ( I was going to go about 100 and change it again).
Lucas Fuel sys cleaner in the gas.

Now the ticking seems like it may have gotten worse? It seems to be running ok, maybe a little bit of a hesitation or rough but my daily driver is a lux/sport car so maybe I'm just paying too close attention to what's wrong with the disco??

I'll stop there so this doesn't get so long that nobody reads it, but I guess my concerns are the noise and the #1 compression being lower.

I'd like to really take care of any carbon problems and rule that out, but I'm not sure what else to try. Any thoughts would be helpful.

 

[99d2]

Have you changed the oil since you put in the ATF and ran Seafoam through? If you haven't, I would change out your oil and filter and see if your problem goes away.

 

[Chongo]

Worried 2000 DII

I was browsing looking for others who may have had issues like mine and found a few things but I'll recap and see what thoughts you guys might have.

2000 DII w/ 101K miles

My wife uses this as her daily driver so I don't drive it as much as I used to. I filled up with gas the other day and then drove it again after a bit. It used about a half of tank of gas with only about 110 miles on the trip. I thought it had been getting worse milage lately but that was a shock to me.

Anyway, it was admittedly overdue for plugs and wires so I did those and I've noticed a bit of a tick thats been getting a little worse. So I did a compression test when I did the the plugs. 7 came back at about 155psi but my #1 came back at only 125psi. This also seems to be the side the tick is on. So with the poor milage, compression test results, and the noise I'm a little worried about what this might be.

So far I've done:

Plugs & Wires
SeaFoam in the intake (the neighbors love it when I do that).
After SeaFoam I changed the oil and filter replaced on quart of oil with AFT and have about 50 miles since that ( I was going to go about 100 and change it again).
Lucas Fuel sys cleaner in the gas.

Now the ticking seems like it may have gotten worse? It seems to be running ok, maybe a little bit of a hesitation or rough but my daily driver is a lux/sport car so maybe I'm just paying too close attention to what's wrong with the disco??

I'll stop there so this doesn't get so long that nobody reads it, but I guess my concerns are the noise and the #1 compression being lower.

I'd like to really take care of any carbon problems and rule that out, but I'm not sure what else to try. Any thoughts would be helpful.



Well for starters, Welcome to the forum

Ticking noises

Ticking noises can be from many things, is the ticking noise only at idle ? Part throttle ? no load ? Load ? RPM specific ? Or increases repetition with RPM? Does the engine have a shimmy or shake to it in respect to the ticking noise? Sluggish Engine responsiveness, Shimmy and shaking and ticking noises Are generally, ( but not always ), related to the valve train, i.e. - Cam, lifters, pushrods, rocker arms, valves, valve springs, spring retainers, valve guides and seats. Oil consumption is also known to cause ticking noises, with buildup
behind the valve face, and on stem as well as combustion chamber build up. Broken eccentric oil pump gear causes ticking as well.
What’s it your oil pressure ?

What condition was #1 cylinder plug when you pulled it ? Color and description?

What plugs and wires did you install in it ?

Who changes your oil ?

What does the new plugs look like now after running them ?
Pull all 8 and let us know, color and description.

Last time Air Filter was changed ?

And of course anything you can think of that may contribute to you
issues.

Sorry, but we are not there so we have to ask these questions.

Take care and be safe……… Chongo……..

 

[stb616]

I changed the oil after the Seafoam, thats when I subed 1 qrt of ATF. Since I did that I'm only at about 75miles. I was going to do another oil change after about 100- so tonight or the next day I'll be changing the oil agian.

To reply to Chongo-

The ticking seems to increase with more RPMs and seems like its worse under load, eigther driving or gently brake torqued. I don't notice any shimmy or rough running. It seems as responsive as it ever was new. As far as oil consumption goes, I don't have to add oil between a 3k mile change. The level will be VERY slightly lower but still very well within the full range, and I do need to replace my valve cover gaskets as they leak to the point of smelling a slight oil bruning off the manifolds.

I don't know the oil pressure, but I've never had any warning lights.

#1 plug was the same as the rest. Golden brown color, worn, with mild carbon deposits.

I was in a hurry to do the plugs and bought autolite plats for the plugs and a while back a bought a parts lot off ebay cheap which had a new set of STT plug wires (not sure what STT's are but they seemed to be a heavier wire that the OEMS). My plan was to at least get new wires and plugs put in quickly and when its not so cold put better plugs and the magnacore wires on it.

I change my own oil every 3-4K using full syn.

Air filter is a K&N that's cleaned every 10K or so and isn't over-oiled ( I learned that the hard way on a different car).

I'll update you when I get a chance to pull the new plugs and take a look at them. Most likely when I change the oil again.

Of coarse I have a biased opinion, but I think I take good care of my cars and most of the miles on it were from highway driving. Now its used mostly for about 3-4 miles each way of city driving since my wife has had it.

The only other thing thats always worried me about it was that I was a pretty violent accident with it a couple years back. I've been told by people that the accident would not have ever caused any mechanical problems but considering I was rearended by and F150 who's driver told me he thought he was going about 40mph when he hit me and was amazed how little damage there was to my truck compared to his.....I've always wondered what a hit like that does the engine and trans. I drove the rover home but after it was towed into the shop we discovered that the engine, trans, and radiator mounts where all broken. When I bounced back into my seat after the impact the drivers seat frame broke- the short drive home was pretty "****'n style." Blah, Blah......it basically broke all sorts of stuff and tweeked the frame in the back. It was all fixed but in my opinion should have been totaled. So, bent a rod or valve or chip one?? People say not possible but like I said don't think anything with moving parts is meant to take that sort of blow and your guess is as good as mine if it did any internal damage but thats the answer to any other potential causes.

The most recent logical advice was to buy a BG kit and at least start with the BG 44k fuel treatment. So that's next on the list.

 

[Chongo]

#1 Cyl. Valve train

I changed the oil after the Seafoam, thats when I subed 1 qrt of ATF. Since I did that I'm only at about 75miles. I was going to do another oil change after about 100- so tonight or the next day I'll be changing the oil agian.

To reply to Chongo-

The ticking seems to increase with more RPMs and seems like its worse under load, eigther driving or gently brake torqued. I don't notice any shimmy or rough running. It seems as responsive as it ever was new. As far as oil consumption goes, I don't have to add oil between a 3k mile change. The level will be VERY slightly lower but still very well within the full range, and I do need to replace my valve cover gaskets as they leak to the point of smelling a slight oil bruning off the manifolds.

I don't know the oil pressure, but I've never had any warning lights.

#1 plug was the same as the rest. Golden brown color, worn, with mild carbon deposits.

I was in a hurry to do the plugs and bought autolite plats for the plugs and a while back a bought a parts lot off ebay cheap which had a new set of STT plug wires (not sure what STT's are but they seemed to be a heavier wire that the OEMS). My plan was to at least get new wires and plugs put in quickly and when its not so cold put better plugs and the magnacore wires on it.

I change my own oil every 3-4K using full syn.

Air filter is a K&N that's cleaned every 10K or so and isn't over-oiled ( I learned that the hard way on a different car).

I'll update you when I get a chance to pull the new plugs and take a look at them. Most likely when I change the oil again.

Of coarse I have a biased opinion, but I think I take good care of my cars and most of the miles on it were from highway driving. Now its used mostly for about 3-4 miles each way of city driving since my wife has had it.

The only other thing thats always worried me about it was that I was a pretty violent accident with it a couple years back. I've been told by people that the accident would not have ever caused any mechanical problems but considering I was rearended by and F150 who's driver told me he thought he was going about 40mph when he hit me and was amazed how little damage there was to my truck compared to his.....I've always wondered what a hit like that does the engine and trans. I drove the rover home but after it was towed into the shop we discovered that the engine, trans, and radiator mounts where all broken. When I bounced back into my seat after the impact the drivers seat frame broke- the short drive home was pretty "****'n style." Blah, Blah......it basically broke all sorts of stuff and tweeked the frame in the back. It was all fixed but in my opinion should have been totaled. So, bent a rod or valve or chip one?? People say not possible but like I said don't think anything with moving parts is meant to take that sort of blow and your guess is as good as mine if it did any internal damage but thats the answer to any other potential causes.

The most recent logical advice was to buy a BG kit and at least start with the BG 44k fuel treatment. So that's next on the list.


The ticking noise can still be many things. But with the compression being low on cylinder #1 I am leaning towards something wrong in the valve train for #1 cylinder, either exhaust or intake. The high possibilities are Lazy lifter, bent pushrod, Possibly something in the rocker shaft, broken valve spring or sticking or burnt valve or seat.
If you’re using a small amount of oil in between oil changes, With the design of the stock breather system, this can be considered normal for this engine, and this is the fix :

http://www.landroverworld.org/forums/member.php?u=7487
.
But I’m talking about a few teaspoons max oil consumption for 3,000 plus miles. Anything above this and there is an internal issue, Valve guides or Piston rings, and they will still run, but a little less than perfect. In a well built engine, there should be almost no oil consumption.
A cylinder leak down test should help isolate the problem. Although this is a site that performs the leak down test on a VW engine, this still shows how it’s done:

http://www.meyerracingonline.com/leak.html

When you pull the new plugs, post the results and I’m sure Joey or I will get back with you. I work all day, usually 12 hours a day, so please excuse me if I don’t respond quickly.

I wish you good luck and Happy Rovering……….Chongo

 

[99d2]

I'm anxiously awaiting the oil change. Stb616, what weight/brand of oil do you use?

 

[stb616]

I'm anxiously awaiting the oil change. Stb616, what weight/brand of oil do you use?

I'm sick so I didn't drive anywhere or do the oil change.

I use full synth. 10w30. I used to use mobile 1 but for the last year or so I've been using quaker state torque?? or something like that. Its there newer full synthetic whatever its actually called.

I might get to it tonight still but I'd rather just go back to bed.

On that note- What brand of oil filters do you guys use? I'm guilty of using Frams in the past, but no longer. I've used motorcraft or Napa gold since someone explained the fram as the little orange can of death to me a while back.

Writing this I'm getting a little more motivated to take care of it tonight. If I do I'll give you the update on plugs too.

 

[Chongo]

Quote:
Originally Posted by 99d2
I'm anxiously awaiting the oil change. Stb616, what weight/brand of oil do you use?
I'm sick so I didn't drive anywhere or do the oil change.

I use full synth. 10w30. I used to use mobile 1 but for the last year or so I've been using quaker state torque?? or something like that. Its there newer full synthetic whatever its actually called.

I might get to it tonight still but I'd rather just go back to bed.

On that note- What brand of oil filters do you guys use? I'm guilty of using Frams in the past, but no longer. I've used motorcraft or Napa gold since someone explained the fram as the little orange can of death to me a while back.

Writing this I'm getting a little more motivated to take care of it tonight. If I do I'll give you the update on plugs too.


Ouch, tis the season to catch a cold…………….. I hope you feel better soon.

Oil filters………… I wouldn’t be surprised if Fram makes motorcrafts filters http://www.fram.com/

Fram, Prestone, Autolite, Bendix and Blink are all subsidiaries of the Honeywell corp. Headquartered in Danbury, CT, FRAM® is a unit of Honeywell Consumer Products Group, which manufactures and markets FRAM® Oil, Air, Transmission and Fuel Filters; Prestone® Antifreeze/Coolant and Car Care products; Autolite® Spark Plugs and Ignition Wire Sets; and Holts® Car Care product
With six North American research and development, manufacturing, and marketing locations in Greenville, Ohio; Perrysburg, Ohio; Clearfield, Nev.; Danbury, Conn.; Mississauga, Ontario; and Stratford, Ontario; FRAM® employs state-of-the-art process control and automated inspection equipment to assure that products are made on time and meet rigorous internal and customer requirements. The plants combined have also earned a number of quality certifications including ISO 14001 and ISO/QS 9000. Today FRAM® is known as America's number one oil filter brand, and the FRAM® team continues to manufacture and market a variety of quality oil, air and fuel filters, as well as many automotive accessories such as PCV valves, crankcase filters and transmission modulators.
In my findings in oil filters, it is far more important to have flow than highly restrictive filtration, especially in cold start ups. There’s a lot of filters on the market with just a few companies who make them. They just put someone else’s insignia on it and pay the filter manufacturer for their manufacturing service. So just because it says “ Tom Smiths oil filters “ doesn’t mean it wasn’t made by Fram.

Not having good oil flow through a oil filter on a cold start, is responsible for many engine rebuilds period. This is a very crucial period for lubrication at a high demand. All Land Rover filters have to have a check valve in the oil filter or all oil drains back into the oil pan. Fram and Coopers have this check valve. If a filter is used that has no check valve it may take up to half a minute for the oil pump to catch prime, meanwhile your engine has no oil were it needs it. This is extremely important and often overlooked in Land Rover owners. There is a way to check for this valve, and that is to suck and blow with you mouth into the threaded hole. You should be able to suck air though it, but not blow air through it. And I’m sure someone will post a comment on this…… This is a good test and actually works regardless of the words used to describe it.

I’ve cut many oil filters apart to see how they are constructed, and I like Frams, they know their math and did their homework.
I’ve cut a few Hastings apart and it looks like someone wadded up a bunch of clean socks inside. Not what I want on my engine. I can’t complain though Hastings filters has made me a lot of money in engine rebuilding. But this filter design doesn’t allow much flow on cold oil. The corrugated fiber filter design that Fram uses is very hard to beat, even Coopers is made just like it, but Frams flow better. Cut them apart and check for yourself, I did.
There is nothing logical with the Fram oil filter or oil you are using being related to your engine issues. First of all your engine oil or filter is not failing you since it took you 101,000 miles per your first post. Second Fram is one of the best filters out there. If you would like to know a little more on oils This is one of my write ups on oil.

http://www.landroverworld.org/forums/showthread.php?t=11763

If one feels the need to have ultimate filtration and flow doesn’t mind cleaning the filter every week, You’ll need to install one of these, I did on My off road race buggies…………….. www.obergraceproducts.com/ One awesome filter used it on all of my 2180 VW engines. You don’t replace it, you just clean it. But I would stock a few O ring screens to be safe.

Per my prior post: http://www.landroverworld.org/forums/member.php?u=7487 I would seriously consider a cylinder leak down test This will tell you were the gasses are leaking to.

Hope this helps and happy holidays…….. I hope you get better soon…………. Chongo.

 

[stb616]

I feel a little better this morning. Still don't really want to go work out in the cold garage, but what do ya do?

On the leakdown test- How do I get the #1 or any cyl for that matter to TDC? I'd like to say I don't know because I'm sick and all drugged up with cold meds but......ah, yeah.

 

[stb616]

Ok, I got the oil changed.

I did the compression test again and the #1 (cyl w/ the low reading last time) came back at about 151psi.

The other cyls came back between 162-168psi. So, I guess I'm at least lessening the spread. Whats the most variance a healthy engine would have?


When I pulled the plugs they didn't like they'd been used at all really. A couple had a little bit of dark black on the ceramic and (wow forgot what its called) the back of the thing the spark jumps to.

I've only driven maybe 15 miles on since adding the BG44k.

Thanks for all input so far.