SkiWill
Member
I would actually argue that there is a solid market for the Grenadier. The Wrangler is terrific off road, but it's miserable as a utility vehicle. The Bronco is basically a Ford Wrangler. They have minuscule payload capacity, a joke of 3500 lb towing capacity, but they have big tires. Really big tires. And that's cool. Really cool bro. Have you seen how big my tires are? And I'm *******. And no doors.
Then the new Defender ended up being another variant of Discovery 5 since JLR seems to only build vehicles that compete with those in its own lineup. No wonder they're losing money.
After years of Jeeps, I finally came to the LR4 because I needed something that was off road worthy, had a decent tow rating, and sizable payload and was safe for a family, but not the titanic size of a Suburban.
If the Ineos has all of those features but with a real ladder frame and hypoid axles, it will effectively have no competitors in the US. The Jeep and Bronco are toys. Fun toys, but toys. If I load a family of 4 and a dog in a Jeep Wrangler Rubicon unlimited or Bronco, I have maybe 300 lbs for additions such as heavier winch bumper, winch, camping gear, fuel, etc. before I'm over legal weight. And that's because my kids are small and don't weigh much. That's a joke right?
And $25-30k for a well used ROW Defender that's at least 25 years old and has no dealer support (I do not consider JLR dealers in the US as support for ROW Defenders) while emotionally tempting, is not an investment that people are making on cold hard facts. Even if the Grenadier is over 50k and I can get diesel range, original Defender payload and off road performance, but not be in an absolute death trap, sign me up.
Make no mistake, I really want a ROW diesel Defender 110, but try arguing with my wife on why it makes sense to spend $25k or more (plenty approaching $60k which is nice used G class money) for a ROW Defender that will leak water in the cab and oil on the driveway, couldn't even meet US safety standards from before we were born, is slow, and has no air conditioning because it has character. I still want one, but not because it makes any logical sense, because it just doesn't so let's all be honest with ourselves.
If the Ineos delivers a real off road utility vehicle with modern safety features and doesn't cost $75-90k like an overly luxurious new Defender or Land Cruiser or $125k for a G class, I'll buy one. Of course I wish that they had secured an engine deal with just about any other engine manufacturer on earth other than BMW...
Then the new Defender ended up being another variant of Discovery 5 since JLR seems to only build vehicles that compete with those in its own lineup. No wonder they're losing money.
After years of Jeeps, I finally came to the LR4 because I needed something that was off road worthy, had a decent tow rating, and sizable payload and was safe for a family, but not the titanic size of a Suburban.
If the Ineos has all of those features but with a real ladder frame and hypoid axles, it will effectively have no competitors in the US. The Jeep and Bronco are toys. Fun toys, but toys. If I load a family of 4 and a dog in a Jeep Wrangler Rubicon unlimited or Bronco, I have maybe 300 lbs for additions such as heavier winch bumper, winch, camping gear, fuel, etc. before I'm over legal weight. And that's because my kids are small and don't weigh much. That's a joke right?
And $25-30k for a well used ROW Defender that's at least 25 years old and has no dealer support (I do not consider JLR dealers in the US as support for ROW Defenders) while emotionally tempting, is not an investment that people are making on cold hard facts. Even if the Grenadier is over 50k and I can get diesel range, original Defender payload and off road performance, but not be in an absolute death trap, sign me up.
Make no mistake, I really want a ROW diesel Defender 110, but try arguing with my wife on why it makes sense to spend $25k or more (plenty approaching $60k which is nice used G class money) for a ROW Defender that will leak water in the cab and oil on the driveway, couldn't even meet US safety standards from before we were born, is slow, and has no air conditioning because it has character. I still want one, but not because it makes any logical sense, because it just doesn't so let's all be honest with ourselves.
If the Ineos delivers a real off road utility vehicle with modern safety features and doesn't cost $75-90k like an overly luxurious new Defender or Land Cruiser or $125k for a G class, I'll buy one. Of course I wish that they had secured an engine deal with just about any other engine manufacturer on earth other than BMW...
But I get 800km on a 75lt tank of fuel and I can carry 4 gerry cans giving my a range of about 1500km, which is great when you are in the back country. I carry my 'pine striping' with pride and I never get tired of the "thumbs up" or cars flying past me and suddenly braking to take a pic on their cell phones. I can fix most anything on it myself with relatively basic tools. Heck, if the battery fails I can still push start it and drive it away. There are no 'idiot lights' on it so I have to lift the hood every now and then to check on things. And when I'm going through 4' of water, watching it gush in through the door seems it makes me grin with pride! I can get most any part for the truck withing 4 days (some take two weeks) but I can get them easily. It will cost me less the $200 to fix a bent front fender......
