LR4 vs Defender

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umbertob

umbertob

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Davidinseattle said:
Yeah, not buying that statement about Soccer moms. How many Brits to you think would line up for this? More than you can count after their beloved Land Rovers were carted off to India.
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Even in its golden years (the 90s) the Defender never sold more than 8/9k vehicles per year on average in all of Europe. In the late 2000s and until they pulled the plug in 2016, sales got so ridiculously low, it's amazing LR manufactured it for as long as they did. Nobody wanted it anymore (except here in North America it seems, but only because we couldn't get it.)

Granted, that was an ancient vehicle even by the standards and tastes of 15 years ago, while this will be brand new and far more advanced in every respect, but you may be overestimating the enthusiast market in the UK (and here) waiting in line for a boxy and utilitarian vehicle like this after the initial excitement fades. There better be some frills inside, so soccer moms will like it. :)
 
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Davidinseattle

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umbertob said:
Even in its golden years (the 90s) the Defender never sold more than 8/9k vehicles per year on average in all of Europe. In the late 2000s and until they pulled the plug in 2016, sales got so ridiculously low, it's amazing LR manufactured it for as long as they did. Nobody wanted it anymore (except here in North America it seems, but only because we couldn't get it.)

Granted, that was an ancient vehicle even by the standards and tastes of 15 years ago, while this will be brand new and far more advanced in every respect, but you may be overestimating the enthusiast market in the UK (and here) waiting in line for a boxy and utilitarian vehicle like this after the initial excitement fades. There better be some frills inside, so soccer moms will like it. :)
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you have some valid points. But let's be fair, not many people are daily driving the old defender without serious suspension modes. It wasn't even and option for about 99% of the use cases. This will likely be more like my f350 which I comfortably daily drive.
 
magus

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End of '21, ok, that means maybe sometime in '22. It's kind of like all the Tesla killers... You bet, great on paper, in the meantime, there's something to be said for a vehicle you can actually drive...
 
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Davidinseattle

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magus said:
End of '21, ok, that means maybe sometime in '22. It's kind of like all the Tesla killers... You bet, great on paper, in the meantime, there's something to be said for a vehicle you can actually drive...
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...that doesn't cost nearly $100k and is a total joke from a quality and design perspective. Yes, i totally agree with you. But that eliminates JLR's new Defender doesn't it? So, now you are left with Jeep. Or wait a few years with your LR4 and hope this pans out. What's the worst that happens? You have to settle for a 2022 Defender that's had the kinks worked out. The best is that these guys actually deliver on a more Defenderesque vehicle at a better price.

Seems to me that's a risk with no real risk. Just sayin'
 
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Yes, competition is not a bad thing. No guarantee JLR will be solvent either in a few years. Perhaps in some form but it could very well be with a new owner. Choices = good. For me my offroad itch is scratched by lightweight barely street legal enduro bikes so in reality the LR4 could be the end of the line for me anyhow unless they make a truck version.
 
CaliDisco

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All I can say is (((Bronco)))
It’s gonna catch LR and the new Defender with its pants around it’s ankles!!!

Gotta tip my hat to Ineos though! Great effort to honor the original.

Also great that folks will have different choices all over the price spectrum as well.

End of the day though- I’ll hold on go my LR4 for a while. It’ll be bit before anything on the horizon is available, sold without a pointless mark-up, and sorted from a technical perspective.
 
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avslash

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If the Bronco shows up with factory 33" tires, a live axle, and available triple lockers JLR better hope the Defender works Karen the soccer mom up into a riotous frenzy of passion because that is who will be left to line up to buy them.

Can you imagine what the aftermarket will do with a Ford after a year or two.
 
Fuji4

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avslash said:
If the Bronco shows up with factory 33" tires, a live axle, and available triple lockers JLR better hope the Defender works Karen the soccer mom up into a riotous frenzy of passion because that is who will be left to line up to buy them.

Can you imagine what the aftermarket will do with a Ford after a year or two.
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Yeah and if it has the 3.5 ecoboost it will be a beast. That’s a great engine. Especially after they added port injectors
 
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NeilP

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umbertob said:
Even in its golden years (the 90s) the Defender never sold more than 8/9k vehicles per year on average in all of Europe. In the late 2000s and until they pulled the plug in 2016, sales got so ridiculously low, it's amazing LR manufactured it for as long as they did. Nobody wanted it anymore (except here in North America it seems, but only because we couldn't get it.)

Granted, that was an ancient vehicle even by the standards and tastes of 15 years ago, while this will be brand new and far more advanced in every respect, but you may be overestimating the enthusiast market in the UK (and here) waiting in line for a boxy and utilitarian vehicle like this after the initial excitement fades. There better be some frills inside, so soccer moms will like it. :)
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In it's latter years it was dreadful . A mess of LandRover and Ford parts . Bad assembly too . The 2020 Defender is quite a price though , as it's a LR4/5 type product with good profit .....
 
navigare

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k-lr4 said:
We will probably keep it till at least 150K. WE would love to keep it if it was only going to be used for daily driving duties around town. But it is also our long distance family tourer and the initial signs of unease (regarding taking it on multi-state trips at that level of mileage and it breaking down and leaving us stranded)
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I don't understand your concern. My mileage is similar and I wasn't afraid to drive from Europe to Central Asia and back last year. No damage except what I broke. I will keep the truck forever!
 
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